Biden delivered remarks from the Oval Office outlining his decision not to seek reelection, his first on-camera remarks since making that announcement on Sunday. In addition to explaining why he is ending his candidacy, he listed off his priorities for his remaining time as president.
āAnd Iām going to call for Supreme Court reform, because this is critical to our democracy,ā Biden said.
Multiple outlets have reported that Biden is considering proposals to establish term limits for Supreme Court justices and an enforceable ethics code for those on the high court.
If I understand the supreme court correctly, Biden could just shoot Roberts, Alito and Thomas and call it court reform, right? That makes it an official act?
Ironically if he did that and appointed new liberal justices, thereās a good chance the new Court would overturn this Courtās decision, and he could be convicted of murder and probably violating several other federal laws for that act.
I think there is something in the constitution about not being able to charge someone criminally for something retroactively, that wasnāt a crime at the time it was committed.
Found it! Article 1, section 9, clause 3.
Ex post facto is for if a new law is passed making something a crime, and the act was committed before its passage. This is all about interpretation of already passed law. Itās basically the justices saying that this was against the law the whole time. Ex post facto doesnāt apply here.
Kamala could pardon him. I donāt think very many of their voters would mind.
The president is currently above the law, so the constitution is as good as toilet paper.
Worth it.
but nothing, nothing can come in the way of saving our democracy
- Joe Biden
Come on, Joe! Go out with a bang!
Joe bang!
Heād be dead before the sentencing anyway. Take one for the team Joe!
Plus, it canāt be that hard to defend him with some perfectly reasonable doubts. A jury wouldnāt convict him for doing the right thing.
Also theyād have Kamala āOfficial Actsā Harris to deal with if they convicted him.
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No laws have been changed. Court decisions are not considered the passage of a law, so ex post facto doesnāt apply. Changes to how laws are interpreted donāt factor into ex post facto considerations.
Yeah, I deleted the comment a while ago when I read another response explaining that. TIL!
No, because heās not a Republican.
However, the justices that make that distinction relevant would no longer be able to do so?
I think the remainder would be against it regardless.
So, to answer seriously: if itās an explicit presidential power he gets total personal immunity, although the office can still be restricted. If itās an official act, heās presumed to have personal immunity unless the prosecutor can argue that thereās no way that not having immunity could get in the way of doing the job of president, and theyāre not allowed to use motivation to make the case.
The president isnāt given the explicit power to reform the courts.
Heās given explicit power to command the armed forces, but the rules of the armed forces are decided by Congress.So itās a question arguing how āthe president canāt kill members of the judiciaryā doesnāt hinder the power of the executive branch without referencing why the president is killing them.
Biden is allowed to kill Supreme Court justices because he might need to Navy SEAL people for security reasons. Allowing litigation on Bidenās SEAL powers would irreparably restrict Bidenās agency as commander in chief and would literally cause a 9/11
Iām horrified to agree that thatās actually a valid argument.
Judicial review of the established presidential power to direct the military to kill, ahem, ādesignate as a clear and immediate threatā, specific individuals in an emergency to protect the country would legitimately undermine the presidents power to defend the integrity of the nation.
Goddamn was that a stupid fucking ruling.
Would it literally? Like hijacked foreign planes flying into buildings? Like invading countries for oil? Literally?
Yes
The argument that the Supreme Court made pretty boils down to āif you let the president go to trial for Navy SEALing a Supreme Court Justice, then the chilling effect of potential litigation would make the president too scared to kill Osama Bin Laden. Therefore the president has legal immunity when Navy SEALing Supreme Court justicesā.
So yes, the Supreme Court actually believes that litigating a president could literally cause another 9/11.
Whoās gonna vote to say it wasnāt official afterwards?
6 or so SC justices?
Oh no, here I go, acting officially again.
perhaps
No need to do it himself. Order assassins to do it as an official act, then immediately pardon them.
Well, he would need a volunteer that way, then he writes them a pardon, because the order is still illegal and they can refuse it, it just doesnāt matter to him.
Much easier to just buy a shotgun, call it Official Acts, and go to town.
I think itās traditional to say āSeal Team 6ā rather than āassassinsā at this point.
Thatās correct
That is only for very specific people. That part is a secret and they donāt tell you who. But Iām certain Biden isnāt on that list.
I would chance it.
I was hoping for that.
Heās a lame duck now. That means heās free to pursue policies that will add to his legacy, and without having to give even the tiniest shit about what the establishment and the donor class might think about it.
Come on Biden. Go to fucking town. Let your legacy be crazy ass fights.
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You can tell the repubes were
A. Caught of guard by this and
B. Have no idea how to handle it.
Iām even wondering if the timing was intentional. Right after the RNC convention and they took all the momentum from Trump in one single announcement. Maybe they lined to the donors to pump up the donations right after the announcement to gain more momentum. If so, it was really genius.
Thatās not entirely true with Kamala being tied to his administration. I still think it would only make her more popular, but his actions arenāt truly lame duck.
I agree in sentiment, but the lame duck doesnāt start until November 6th. And we need to stop normalizing otherwise because the republicans have already weaponized it.
Add 2 seats to the bench, and then add 13 total judges. 11 of 22 judges are selected at random to determine the case. The non voting judge opinion becomes part of the case law, as well as an intercollegiate constitutional scholar opinion
This matches the broad strokes of the approach I favor as well.
There are 13 Federal circuits. Expand to one justice per circuit, then double that.
But the core of the approach, regardless of the exact number, is to shift to having cases heard by randomized panels of judges. The amount of power wielded by individual justices right now is just insane. Dilute it down so that the power rests with the body rather than individuals.
Further, randomizing who hears any given case would help curtail the current environment where test cases get tailored to the idiosyncracies and pet theories of individual judges.
SCOTUS should be deciding cases based on rational reading of the law, not entertaining wing nut theories that Thomas or Alito hinted at in previous decisions. That sort of nonsense becomes a lot less feasible if thereās no guarantee a case will actually end up in front of Thomas or Alito.
So what happens when the judges chosen for a case interpretation end up being 7-2 in one partyās favor? Conservatives would be sitting at the slot machines in a diaper pulling the lever until they hit a jackpot. Itās not like making them sit out of some cases based on a lottery is going to make them any less hypocritical or prone to power tripping and bribery. Theyāll just wait their turn.
Appointees should just be subject to term limits and yearly affirmation votes by members of the BAR association to renew or revoke their qualifications. That way members of the public that are still well versed in law are able to hold them accountable.
I think youāre missing the point.
As things stand now, you get cases that are tailor made to the whims of specific people because thereās a 100% chance it ends up in front of those specific people. Thatās an absolutely massive problem.
The point is that youāre less likely to have cases that are specifically aimed at stroking any given individualās brand of crazy when thereās only a ~1 in 3 chance theyāll even hear it. A panel of 9 from a pool of 26 means that you go from a 100% chance that, say, Alito and Thomas, hear a case together to around 12%. Thatās a huge gamble when it takes years and a massive amount of money to get a case in front of SCOTUS.
No, it doesnāt solve all conceivable problems with the court. But itād help address the fact that SCOTUS justices are entirely too powerful as individuals and it can be done via simple act of Congress.
Appointees should just be subject to term limits and yearly affirmation votes by members of the BAR association to renew or revoke their qualifications
Not going to happen. SCOTUS terms are life appointments constitutionally. That means youāve gotten into amendment territory which just plain is not realistic right now.
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Article III only lays out there there will be a supreme court and a Chief justice and makes Congress responsible for establishing them. It does not lay out the makeup or structure of that court. The current body of 9 justices is set by federal statute and could be changed by a simple act of Congress.
Article III also explicitly states that whatever Justices are appointed hold their office as long as they maintain good behavior (I e., as long as they havenāt been impeached) and that Congress cannot reduce their pay.
Term limits are explicitly unconstitutional.
Setting the number of judges is explicitly within Congressā constitutional powers.
Randomized panels would probably be challenged just because itās never been tested, but the language in the Constitution re: Congress establishing the Supreme Court is vague. That said, Congress has already established inferior Federal courts that operate in this manner, so thereās precedent.
Appointments are for life, but Iāve seen arguments itās possible to āretireā justices to powerless seats so they technically keep the job and title. Or rotate them out of SCOTUS cases to the federal circuits, so they still keep their title but have the role and power of regular judges.
Supreme Court function is a hot button topic right now because of Roe v. Wade. The vast majority of Americans agree that at the very least SCJs should have term limits, so start there and force a vote on an amendment. Then if it fails, you have votes on record for the next election. Many Republicans have pro-choice, pro-union, anti-lobbying stances that arenāt aware that their representative in congress would vote against because it never comes to their table in the first place. Some(not all) would change their vote from red to at least 3rd party if we were able to highlight those issues in voting records during campaign season.
And even if you feel that isnāt worth the time or energy for only speculative shifts in the public vote, the opinion youāre expressing is that the constitution should remain unchanged until some undetermined date in the future which may never come. And that is more damaging to the bureaucratic system than a proposed amendment failing because definitions shift over time. It wasnāt too long ago that property was determined to include black people because it suited the interest of wealthy land owners in the south. Then because of that we ended up fighting a civil war.
The problem is that the process for amending the Constitution is heavily, structurally biased in favor of the Republicans now. The GOP would absolutely rally around this issue because itās one of the primary things allowing them to hang on to power right now.
I donāt believe in engaging in theatrics with a zero percent chance of success when there are real, feasible steps that could be taken to make things better.
If you triple instead of double that you could have a three judge panel (like federal districts do) that could rule on smaller cases that come out of that circuit. Then, if needed, they could call a full 9 - 11 judge panel if itās a larger topic. This would also allow them to hear many more cases than they currently do, which has been a problem for decades.
Iād be in favor of more. 26 is just because I think thereās a very easy argument to make for āevery circuit gets direct representation on SCOTUSā and itās not a huge leap to go to two per circuit from there.
Increasing throughput is definitely one of the reasons Iād support doing this as well. Thanks for highlighting that since I didnāt.
I totally agree! Just saying you could make that exact same argument but for three per district and it opens up a bunch more possibilities.
A modern day Cincinnatus, the Supreme Court just made him a consul and he just chose to go back to being a common man for the good of the republic.
If this plays out, heāll go down in history books as the man who sacrificed himself to save Democracy.
From what I understand Cincinnatus gave up his dictatorship because he just liked to farm, and while he was an effective and generally good leader, he just liked to farm.
Give it up for Jimmy Carter
Who wouldnāt?
Out in the fresh air, soil in your hands, working the land to bring forth food.
Or
Court intrigue, back stabbing (literally sometimes), mountains of paperwork, assholes attacking your country at times. That shit would get old quick.
Donāt be so quick to rush into farming. I went from IT to farming and just spent 3 hours in the ER getting stitched back up, for about the 4th time in 5 years, and Iām probably ahead of most.
It aināt a safe occupation. I should do something less hazardous like being a cop.
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Iām not brave enough for that.
But farming? Really? Man of your talents?
Many great leaders want peace and quiet at some point. This resonates with me for sure.
Washington very definitely wanted to get back to Mount Vernon. Jefferson always said he wanted to stay at home, but that was at least partially performative.
Itās a peaceful life.
He should work on all of these:
Term limits for Supreme Court
Abolish Electoral college
Restrictions on corporate real estate investing
Forgive student loans
Restrictions on members of government trading stocks
Heās been working on #4 pretty consistently at least
Whatās the average amount of student loan forgiveness that students have received? Do you think it is more or less than a months rent?
Unfortunately blanket student loan forgiveness keeps getting blocked by republicans in congress or judges theyāve appointed. Theyāve only been able to provide relief to those who need it most. I know I havenāt gotten any. But thatās why average isnāt a great metric to use here-- I donāt need it, others do. Not to mention, average in terms of what-- absolute monetary value? Proportion of money received compared to total loan balance? Compared to original loan balance before interest?
Because Iām bored though, Iāll humor you.
Total direct loan forgiveness (not counting repayment pauses during covid or other relief measures): $167 billion
Total US outstanding student loan debt: $1.77 trillion
Total US outstanding student loan borrowers: 42.8 million
Average student loan debt per outstanding borrower: ~$40k (same source as above)
Total percentage of debt cancelled: 167m/1770m = 9.4%
Average debt relief per person: $3,900 (!)
So yes, itās paid for multiple months worth of rent, and relieved about 10% of everyoneās debt on average! Better than I expected.
The first two of those will require constitutional amendments. Thatās a years-long process.
Better get started then
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Hopefully Kamala would continue that process
Not really. Thereās a popular vote interstate compact that is designed to bypass a constitutional amendment. Basically, the law says that once enough states agree to it, meaning to total electoral votes reaches 270, their votes go for whichever candidate won the popular vote.
I am well familiar with that one, but that is a state-level endeavor, and Iām not sure that Biden, as a federal office-holder, should be involved in that.
He could encourage states to join
Thereās already a state-level effort on #2 thatās pretty far along: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact
Ranked choice voting in all national elections.
Electoral districts by GIS hexagon mapping.
NTRA, National Railroad Trackage Rights Act, which allows any railroad to run on any other railroadās trackage and service any customer to promote competition.
Death penalty for any self-identified religious person violating any rule in their religion.
1 million dollar fine for each falsehood or misleading statement on broadcast media, including entertainment and drama. Normalizing lying has to stop.
All theft and burglary convictions, including white collar, require making whole of all consequences to the victims instead of incarceration.
National Police Registry (NPR) for all enforcement personnel.
Thatās a wild list haha. Youāre a dreamer.
Regarding RCV, it has to happen at the state level. I support that tho
He can call for whatever he wants, but with a Republican house and less than 60 votes in the Senate, it goes nowhere.
If I remember right, he called for Marijuana legalization and student loan forgiveness as well.
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Not shitting on Biden in that comment, just pointing out that āCallingā for something doesnāt mean shit.
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Heās not running tho
Which is now why heās doing it. No more fucks given
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As I understand it, Diplomatic Immunity still has limits but the new and improved Presidential Immunity has very little. Just need to prove official acts and youāre good to go.
Just like he let abortion rights be abolished so he could campaign on it.
ācall forā??? FUCK THAT! just issue a few āofficial presidential actsā drone striking the corrupt ones, and also anyone who refuses to approve the replacements he appoints.
Iām hoping he makes a bunch of executive decisions, make a few crazy ones, pardons himself and bounce.
Especially if he invites the supreme court to correct their presidential immunity mistake as his last act. Of course, shit that wasnāt illegal when you did it canāt (usually) legally be charged after itās made illegal. Ex post facto laws are a hard sell.
That wouldnāt be an ex post facto law situation though, would it? There is no new law, just a different interpretation.
Oh boy, heāll call for it! Great! Thanks!
In his final monthsā¦ Not now, but, you know, get ready for it. I guess.
āCall forā. What does that even mean? Flex those executive muscles.
Itās more āthoughts & prayersā
They didnāt give him unlimited power to compel things, just the apparent ability to legally break laws. So unless he is sending people with guns and or handcuffs to compel things, nothing would happen.
For example if he made an Executive Order outlining corruption consequences, the Supreme Court would just say āLol no!ā He could send in people to arrest them I guess, but he would have to suspend their constitutional rights to a trial. I donāt think people would feel good watching people get no due process.
But he has no power to do that, right? Congress would have to go along, and the Supreme Court is not gonna just do it themselves.
Yeah. Specifically, Mitch ātoo close to an electionā McConnell would block the confirmation.
Or so I assume. I had to go see if he was still alive, because I hadnāt heard from him in a while. Seems he got booed at the RNC.
He can have the CIA assassinate them, and keep it top secret. The Judiciary is itās own section and without a true act of congress or Constitutional Amendment nothing can change without the Supreme Court going in on it.
That Supreme Court case just set in stone what all Presidents have had for what they did in office. George W. never spent time in jail for war crimes, Reagan never went away for arming paramilitary groups, and Nixon didnāt go to jail for spying on the DNC.
Weird how those guys are all in the same party.
To be fair we could add Obama to the list too.
The constitution does not block Bidenās scotus reform
āCall forā, cool cool cool cool cool
Continuing to behave as if thereās a few brushfires that need put out, instead of a massive forest fire going on around himā¦well, it just sums the man up for me.
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I declare reform!
Crazy. Ive been thinking about enforceable ethics codes for companies. This would be a great start towards that.
But have you Called for those things?
